The question we all want the answer to.

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Postby Tituba » Thu Jun 28, 2007 1:56 am

I love this old thread, so I'm bumping it for new insights.
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Thanks for the BUMP

Postby RavenWolf » Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:08 am

Are there many of you who identify with NT? That you can't be happy unless your \"day job\" is enjoyable and/or meaningful?
Yes, I identify with that. See, I'm fort unite enough (& am grateful for this!) to be living with my fiance, who makes just enough for us to eat & pay bills. Basic survival. So.... when the \"survival instinct\" is not being triggered quite as much.... but I'd still like to contribute financially to this family.... and I have a strong feeling there is something in me that I need to do, but I just don't have an exact name for it yet... what do I do??? This has become all I do... every day... Day in and day out... This is my \"job\". Trying to figure out what \"IT\" IS! I know it doesn't have to be just one thing... and I'm having a little creative fun with trying to come up with ways to put horses back in my life, and make a little spare cash making commercials for Infiniti. (sent off a bunch of emails today, in fact) And I know I still need an artistic outlet... working on a screenplay, finding a way to sing in public (even if it's just a karaoke bar... just because I get a kick out of doing it...) But, the main thing is MISSING. And the problem is that I don't even know what it's called, or if it even EXISTS! Private Investigator? Close, but not quite it, because they spend too much time doing stakeouts of cheating spouses and background checks for new employees. What I want to do is more involved with the psychology and spirituality of a violent criminal. Criminal Profiler? According to the FBI website (which I've read quite a lot of, during all the hours of all the days, every single day, that I dedicate to trying to solve this puzzle....which seems to be missing some pieces and I don't even know what shape the puzzle should MAKE)... there is no such thing as having the profession of a Profiler. There are only 4 people, according to the FBI site, that even DO the kinds of thing that a profiler is supposed to do. Any other loosely related field.... crime scene investigator, parole officer, 911 operator, etc etc etc.... is so far away from where my passion lies that it's not even worth mentioning. I've dedicated my life to trying to understand deeply disturbed people and dark criminal minds. I KNOW there has to be a career that would use this passion.... I just don't know what it is. What am I supposed to do??? I've even tried to take the advice of \"make a lesser goal that you'd enjoy, just to get the satisfaction of reaching it...and it'll boost your self esteem\" and I CAN'T EVEN COME UP WITH SOMETHING TO DO THERE, EITHER! It's like something in me has locked up and shut down! :?
Bob Bletcher: This Millennium Group - They really believe all that stuff - Nostradamus and Revelations, the destruction of the world? Frank Black: They believe we can't just sit back and hope for a happy ending.
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Postby jcjm » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:59 am

I started this thread almost 4 years ago and have seen a lot of discussion, but very few success stories. I think the reason for this is similar to when I went to a job seekers group. Once you have the A Ha moment and are doing your dream, you are too busy to continue with the group. So, I think there are many people who have come through this board and have solved this question, they just have moved on. I seem to always be in the situation Les Brown describes in his books, where you are comfortable enough not to leave, but not satisfied enough to keep from looking. Like many people, I go through periods of 1 making money and doing what I hate 2 or doing what I love and living in poverty 3 or doing something that's OK and pays OK But like many I want it all, something I love that pays great and I haven't found that yet.
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haven't found that yet.

Postby RavenWolf » Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:59 pm

wow...that's depressing.... :cry: :oops:
Bob Bletcher: This Millennium Group - They really believe all that stuff - Nostradamus and Revelations, the destruction of the world? Frank Black: They believe we can't just sit back and hope for a happy ending.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby RayofLight » Sun Dec 18, 2011 8:46 am

A agree with jcjm. People who have broken the barrier don't need to discuss so much because they are doing. I feel that I am near a break through by taking baby steps toward grant writing. I have a lot of "what if" conversations with myself still and have been very disheartened with not being able to find a job. However, I am taking small steps to become an LLC, get professionally made business cards and networking. Right now, everything is going slowly because I have had several obstacles--caregiving, death, estate matters, potentially losing an apartment, etc. But I intend to keep going. I feel like I'm trudging through mud.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby BarbaraSher » Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:23 am

Are you doing it alone? If so, you're putting a drag on the momentum and everything's going to be harder.

If you can work with someone else, even by phone or email 'meetings,' and even if you're both working on different projects, it will change everything. Give it a try.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby SquarePeg » Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:29 am

I thought the universal question was "Why?" and secondarily "What's in it for me?"

Anyway, for me, it helped that I figured what I wanted before I started working. "What Color is Your Parachute?" helped me a great deal in the early 1980s with the introspection I needed to make some good decisions. And I always sought out the most flexible employers rather than choose jobs or fields that paid top dollar.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby Scenario Thinker » Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:36 am

SquarePeg wrote:"What Color is Your Parachute?" helped me a great deal in the early 1980s with the introspection I needed to make some good decisions. And I always sought out the most flexible employers rather than choose jobs or fields that paid top dollar.

That's funny, that book helped me get my first job in the early 80s also.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby BarbaraSher » Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:37 am

Re jcjm's comment, there is one option I didn't see there and I recommend it highly:

Doing something (for money) that's not bad, just not enough and doesn't eat up all your time.

And,

Doing what you really love on your own time, and not requiring that it earns money.

Most of the things we enjoy in life don't bring in money: a garden, a car, a wonderful dog or cat, kids, being in a band, making someone laugh, loving someone. Too often when you get paid to do what you love, you have to adapt your dream to what the market will carry. If you write poetry no one will give you a dime. But if you try to use that ability to write ad copy, you'll regret it. Like I said on YouTube: If you like sex, don't be a hooker. Do it for fun. You'll be happier in the long run.

These days finding any job at all can be tough, forget if you can tolerate it. Everybody needs income to survive. And life throws you curves you have to deal with, whether you have money or not, as we've all seen.

But that has nothing to do with doing what you love. In fact, the two elements that will invariably allow you do what you love (and might let you get started right away) are: 1) First, do only the part you love the most. 2) Second, do not require that it earns income.

Give it a try.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby Scenario Thinker » Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:41 am

BarbaraSher wrote:If you like sex, don't be a hooker. Do it for fun. You'll be happier in the long run.

I haven't quite heard that example before, but it's spot on! :)
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby BarbaraSher » Sun Dec 18, 2011 3:38 pm

:-) I'll find the link to the video. I think it's on youtube.

Was looking back at the beginning of this topic and found some answers to jcjm's query - or shall I say 'queries.' Because there are quite a few. But I see that I've answered this question more than once in this topic, and so have others. Good answers, too. Here's one:


Postby katchal » Wed May 28, 2003 3:48
I get paid to do what I love to do anyway. I love marketing in the same way a painter loves painting and when there isn't enough work, I do it pro bono just for fun. Since the early 1990’s I’ve had a blast surfing the leading edge of the technology wave.

Some of my jobs were great; some sucked. But throughout the run I have pursued my touchstones: marketing and cool technology. While some board members would dismiss this as simply having the good luck to enjoy "putz work," that is not the case. Yes, I have special gifts and talents that give me a natural advantage as a marketer, but over the past 15 years I've also worked VERY hard at developing those natural talents by: 1) learning nearly every skill in my profession, 2) earning respected educational credentials, 3) learning the business structure and earning models of my industry.

That gives me enormous earning flexibility. When the cellular market matured, I switched to the emerging Internet industry. When the market for public relations tanks, I can build Web sites and write collateral. When there are no good jobs, I can become a consultant and earn money for any of 25 different types of marketing projects.

My advice: evaluate your entire basket of skills and credentials then cross reference those with the touchstones of what you love. Then, work like hell to become the best *whatever* that you can possibly be. That is how you find good paying work that fulfills what you love.

Also, do the work to find out how people are making a living doing what you want to do and how companies make a profit offering it. The USA has an appalling record in exposing people to vocational opportunities. You have to be willing to research the industry, learn the business side of the profession you want to pursue, and seek out the jobs that are available within your skill set. If you don't have all the skills you need, take a related job and start building them. Don’t forget to look at the industries that support the thing you love - there are lots of good jobs there.

I once met a guy who loved art but worked for a moving company and didn’t have the educational degrees to get a job at a museum or auction house. He found a job working for a moving company that specialized in providing the high-security, high quality moving services required for transporting art exhibits from city to city. He loved it, learned the business, and became a well-paid manager in a very profitable company while working in the "art world" he so wanted to be a part of.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby Scenario Thinker » Sun Dec 18, 2011 4:18 pm

BarbaraSher wrote:My advice: evaluate your entire basket of skills and credentials then cross reference those with the touchstones of what you love. Then, work like hell to become the best *whatever* that you can possibly be. That is how you find good paying work that fulfills what you love.

I always liked this story of the dashboard guy:
viewtopic.php?p=221824#p221824
The ten year thing I got from Outliers, by Malcolm Gladwell

I've done a similar thing. Not many people would consider manipulating reams of data and coding all that glamorous or sexy. But, it's amazing in this computerized world the number of people who still come to me to do the simplest things with files, directories, spreadsheets, etc. Most just don't have the interest.

Now, I'm in a new group where almost everyone knows more than me in their world of coding, data, procedures and business rules. But, I'll slowly chip away at it and eventually, I'll probably know more than most, not to mention the other stuff I bring to the group that they have no idea how to do (or very well, at least).

I think the piece most people miss is the "work like hell" one. I was a slow learner on that, myself.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby BarbaraSher » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:57 am

Thanks, ST. The credit goes to Katchal, whose post I lifted that from. And you're right: 'work like hell' is one of the overlooked tips.

It's nothing to worry about, of course. If you're doing something you enjoy, you'll also enjoy working like hell to get *really* good at it.
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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby Elaine Glimme » Tue Jan 17, 2012 7:53 pm

I haven't thought about this in a long time. I used to hate my job. I remember my boss telling me how much better it was to hire someone with fresh ideas from another company rather than to promote someone from within. I was terrified of interviewing and writing resumes and getting turned down, so I stuck with it.

One day my boss walked by me and I stuck my foot out and slightly tripped him. I apologized as if it were an accident "You tried to trip me. I saw you!!!!! That was no accident." I'm not normally a violent person. It was time to do something. I quit. With no job prospects. I did have some savings to tide me over for several months. I really wouldn't recommend quitting without another job available, but I don't recommend tripping your boss either.

The unemployment office had a program called Experience Unlimited. It taught people like me how to write resumes, pass interviews, and look for jobs. And we all helped each other with the job search.

Some snippets that I learned:

In your resume, emphasize the experience and skills you have that you think your prospective employer is looking for. I wrote different resumes for different jobs.
Dress appropriately.
Research the prospective company and the prospective job. Read the job announcement carefully.
Practice job interviews with your friends and family. Toastmasters is a good place to develope speaking skills.
Write a short thank you note for the interview.
Accept that getting turned down is part of the game and don't take it personally.

I found a job within a couple of months. It was a bad place to work, and I knew that if I stayed there for any length of time, I would be unhappy. But, meanwhile, it paid the bills, and I had acquired job hunting skills.

Networking is the big key to finding a job. My friend Kay worked for the county and showed me a job flyer for hazardous materials specialist. I took a hazardous materials course at UC extention to help me do well on the interview. I got the job and stayed there for twenty happy years.

No job is perfect, and, when you're dealing with people and hazardous chemicals, a bad day is a really bad day. Still, for me, haz mat was a job I loved. Now I'm retired and I'm trying to find another job I love.

Words of wisdom from me. Job hunting is only scary when its an unknown. Like anything else, you get better at it the more you do it. It's okay to go to an interview and sound like a moron. From that experience, you learn how to make a better impression on your next interview. Also, the mentor from Experience Unlimited told us that we were unemployed, but we had a forty hour per week job. It was called looking for work.

And whatever you're doing, whether working at a job or looking for work, you may as well do your very best.

Good luck to everyone reading this.

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Re: The question we all want the answer to.

Postby jims » Thu Feb 09, 2012 6:06 pm

I have created the kind of life I love. The book Wishcraft and a few others along the same line were very helpful. I used my job which provided a good steady income, until I was able to retire early--age 51. I cut back on things and lived on my savings and investments for three years, until a bit of a pension kicked in. But I started my plan years before by studying finance and investing. I also cut back on things that wasted money. It is amazing how much we waste and can do without. I borrowed books and movies from libraries. I learned to do most of the maintence on my home, car, and lawnmower. One can save a great deal by keeping the car repaired. To keep motivated, I walked thorugh the stacks of libraries, imagining the time I would be able to do what I loved the most--read and learn.

For over 10 years I've lived the life of my dreams. During my first 6 years of retirement, I read over 1000 books from libraries. I tried a number of part-time, temporary work, mostly to keep busy and learn new trades. I taught college part-time; worked as a tax consultant (started as a volunteer), and helped my friends with construction (plumbing, dry wall, roofing). We sold our home and moved to the beautiful state of Colorado. I love hiking. Currently, my passion is studying Mars. As an amateur I was able to use two satellites that went around Mars. Most months, I receive pictures from Mars that almost no one has seen before. Along with others, we have written essentially an encyclopedia of Mars--almost everything discovered about Mars is there.

At any rate, I had to create a vision of my ideal life, then a detailed plan for achieving it. What I did different from some others is that I just moved along--putting one foot in front of another, each day, marching in the direction of my dreams. I studied the martial arts for decades; that study gave me lots of discipline. Or maybe, I just wanted things more than others. We all have problems. I had to bring my personal demons under control. First was stopping my excessive drinking one day at a time (its been over 30 years since I was an insaine drunk).

I hope others can take some inspiration from what I've tried to write. There is really a lot of wisdom on these boads and in Barbara Sher's books.
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