"So what do you do?"

[pmetcher]

I have re-read some of the posts in this thread and it has started to occur to me that there are some people, me included, that are, at least by their words, making assumptions about the person asking them "what do you do?" and their motivation for asking the question. perhaps, as suggested by Tituba suggests "we" stop being defensive and suspicious. I think the reason Thinker's comment about answering with Why? appealed to the side of me that likes to be a little revolutionary and buck the system. Hang on a minute while I write a new project in my daybook. Back soon. Cheers Peter

[pattyn]

It would be nice Tituba if 'others' gave some thought as to why they ask 'what do you do ?' before they identified people by their occupation. They are not actually thinking at all when they do the 'you are valued by what you do' thing without considering the person, not their occupation.

As one who asks it, I resent being told I'm "not actually thinking at all." Because I've given it thought, I try to ask a question that any human ought to be able to answer with pride and with a great deal of freedom to present themselves in the best possible light, and one of my favorites, for new acquaintances who are out of bed, is "What do you do?" I hope that if I ever get the chance to ask it of you, you'll tell me about the parts of your day or year that fill you with joy or make you feel most valuable.

[Tituba]

It would be nice Tituba if 'others' gave some thought as to why they ask 'what do you do ?' before they identified people by their occupation. They are not actually thinking at all when they do the 'you are valued by what you do' thing without considering the person, not their occupation.

Ah, but, what if the receiver of the question is the one not thinking? What if the asker has sincere interest and the receiver is just jumping to the worst conclusion? If someone asked "how are you doing?" would you think them judging your health and worth? Everyone has their own sore spots. For some it is "do you have children" - others "are you married" Whatever. I just don't see why asking what someone does automatically means the asker is a thoughtless, judging clod. Just maybe they want to establish common ground and have sincere interest. There are enough reasons to put up barriers to friendships without manufacturing them by assuming the worst intentions by a simple question.

[Thinker]

Let's go back to where this began on 11 July and look at why we got into the discussion. We were discussing our gripes. Lots of us don't like being asked 'what do you do' because we aren't fitting into a box. You guys who are kind, thoughtful and loving people do not have any problem with it, have no agenda to your questions and this is not who we are talking about. It's not about you. Since you are not who we are talking about here, it is why the tongue in cheek approach by myself and others. We wouldn't be here if we didn't observe or see our world differently from the rest would we ? Permit me to make observations without taking it personally. I see this as an information exchange on ways of dealing with our Scanner-ness. What I am talking about here is a cultural issue. The way that as a culture we are now identified by what we do. Lots of people do ask 'what do you do' for that reason - to identify you, classify you, compartmentalise you. It really happens and this was the whole point of the discussion.

[Tituba]

You guys who are kind, thoughtful and loving people do not have any problem with it, have no agenda to your questions

Just because you think there is an agenda, doesn't mean there is one. One person cannot know what a stranger is thinking when they ask a question. To be on the defensive, offended and hostile when asked a question - you assume an agenda & the worst in people. How can this make you happy?

[Energygirl]

I used to feel true agony when asked this question - I would think to myself "which life should I tell them about?" Since reading "Refuse to Choose", I have been experimenting with answering by saying "I do a lot of things." And then I...WAIT. Some people respond with a look of true fear on their faces, some people actually look angry, some look doubtful, most look curious despite themselves, some envious, and then, every now and then, some people look excited and say "oh, me too!" and then I know I have met another scanner. Whatever their reaction, this has made me much more aware of people's reactions- I am able to step back and be witness to them- and, I feel empowered instead of pathetic. After the "moment" has passed, I then go with my feeling in that moment- if they seem supportive or open, I'll talk about what I feel like talking about right then. If they seem negative or closed, I generally stop there unless they ask something specific. This has been a great lesson because it has heightened my awareness and that in turn gives me the chance to be more self-protective when faced with someone who is not sympathetic.

[Tricky Grama]

Another way to look at this subject is how it has evolved. Do you remember years ago when the question was: "Do you work?" ?? That has evolved into: "What do you do?" probably due to the sensitivity towards stay at home moms. Patty

[Scenario Thinker]

\"What do you do?\" is somewhere in between \"How are you?\" \"Nice weather we're having\" and \"How often do you take a bath?\" \"How much money would you say you're worth?\" It also depends on if you just met the person, or you've known them for a while and have a comfortable rapport. Yes, it is sort of a cultural thing in America, it is a little personal, and yet the person may genuinely be interested in what your gifts are. If someone like Barbara were to ask me (even if I didn't know who she was), but then learned later that's what she DID, that would be totally non-threatening. But, other than that I do think most people want to gage your place in society to some extent. Maybe a better way to ask is, \"What do you like to do?\". This opens it up to work, hobbies or just leisure activities. This would open up more chance for common ground, work or otherwise. P.S. I had a single friend who lived in California for awhile during the internet boom (bubble), and women would ask him point blank how much money he made. I guess he had to pass that test before they went any further.

[Jezicka]

Since reading "Refuse to Choose", I have been experimenting with answering by saying "I do a lot of things." And then I...WAIT. Some people respond with a look of true fear on their faces, some people actually look angry, some look doubtful, most look curious despite themselves, some envious, and then, every now and then, some people look excited and say "oh, me too!" and then I know I have met another scanner.

I love your solution, Energygirl! (And welcome to the Sher boards, by the way! I can see you're going to be a great addition!) I've often had the problem of what to answer, too, not having had a very traditional career for most of my life-- and always having lots of things I could say I 'do'. Usually I just choose the most prosaic and traditional-sounding of my various pursuits-- in order not to frighten or threaten the asker, who is usually just trying to make polite conversation. This question was very hard on my father for a few years, though, when he had given up his own career to follow my mother. This was back in the days before there were 'house husbands'-- which is a term he would happily have used. It was a great relief to him when he was finally old enough to tell people he was retired! Scenario's right about it being a cultural thing-- in this country it's generally very acceptable to ask what a stranger 'does'-- but in some I've lived in it would be quite offensive. And I had to warn my students on Taiwan that asking things like how much money you make, or why you don't have children is NOT generally acceptable in English-speaking countries. (And when I tried to explain this I could expect to be questioned closely as to why on earth anyone would be offended-- or even lectured on why they shouldn't be!) So please don't argue about it folks-- it is, after all, useful for all of us to know that some people find the question offensive, some are embarassed by it, while others think it a fine first question to ask and look forward with an open mind to interesting responses.

[jacob]

I'm coming in late on this thread, but I think that What Do You Do? means What is Your Occupation?. You can give the literal answer or be more creative. One hopes that everyone, in the general sense, Does a Lot of Things. I'm curious that this has sparked such an enthusiastic debate. Seems cut and dried to me.

[Thinker]

Love an enthusiastic debate ! I think it needs saying that there is a lot of difference between the cultural norm and what people individually do in their relations to others. After two papers in sociological studies I am quite confident that we are identified by what we do. It is part of the commodification of bodies, ie getting value out of bodies. We are supposed to spend money on looking good for the sake of the economy - so being gainfully employed and spending it on dressing well suits the dominant politics. The better sounding your job, the better you appear to be assisting society. That is why it is hard for mum's to be taken as important since they are not 'productive' in the economical way, even if you think mum's produce a lot more than money, as I do ! In fact one research project I did recently showed that in a risk society, overweight people are judged to be not managing their health and could face sanctions for that. That's how biopolitics ideals work. We can make a choice to keep on being who we are and doing what we do, but remembering that out there in the wider world these cultural norms exist. Just as it was in all the ages in history, underlying patterns of social interaction and politics are there.

[AthenaCat42]

What an interesting thread!!! I used to HATE it when people asked me what I did. That was back in my secretarial days when I felt like I wasn't doing what I ought to with my life - but I didn't know what that was. Basically I just wasn't happy with who I was, didn't know how to get what I wanted out of life, and I didn't believe in myself. Add to that mix a twin brother who is the conssumate extrovert, entertaining storyteller, and world-traveller - when everyone asks about him they get excited, then what do I say? I answer phones? How dull is that?? (Yes, I know I can talk it up differently, think about it differently, that's just how I felt then.) However, now since I need to talk up my business to get clients & interest in my programs & etc., \"what do I do\" becomes a fun opportunity for me to present my passion and find out if I've come across a new client, potential client, or referral. My take on the whole thing is that people aren't meaning anything by the question, it's just one of our socially-acceptable ways to start a conversation, but nevertheless, it seems that judgement DOES take place depending on the answer. I'm a bit behind on the thread, but as I read, I was thinking there are a LOT of fun ways to respond, like saying you're a Resource Manager. When I was fully disabled & dysfunctional, I used to say \"I watch TV and play computer video games,\" because, well, that's what I did! As for the \"children\" question, I typically say \"yes, I have three, they're four-legged & furry,\" and give them a goofy grin. Usually takes them a minute to figure it out, and I then clarify that I have 3 cats.

[Thinker]

On the question of what do you do - here's some more from our Rupert Murdoch paper here in Australia - The Weekend Australian. An article by Deborah Hope about stay at home mums..... Leslie Morgan Steiner, an advertising executive at The Washington Post has weighed in with "Mommy Wars: Stay at Home and Career Moms Face Off on Their Choices, Their Lives, Their Families" "For Steiner's mummies, work is a lifestyle choice revolving around identity. For the most part they are journalists, sitcom writers, editors, media executives and novelists and a more selfish, hysterical bunch would be hard to find. Their worst moments are at cocktail parties, book launches or dinner parties where those taking time off from their highly paid labours to care for babies are humiliated by the crushing question, 'What do you do?', and the silence that follows the answer :' I'm a stay-at-home mum'" Look forward to comments on this one.... T.

[KarlG]

I always liked a response I once heard in a movie, unfortunately I'm vague about what movie it was but I think it was Bill Murray who spoke it, I may be mangling it a bit but you get the gist of its philosophical zing...! Q: So, what do you do? A: Well... it really depends on the situation... Unfortunately I lack the chutzpah to use such a line, instead I usually mumble something designed to bore the questioner as quickly as possible... I do agree that it's often a genuine attempt at being friendly when people get desperate for a conversation topic. I try not to ask it though, preferring something broader like, "So, what's exciting in your life lately?". If their job is the answer to that question, I'm happy to hear about it, but if there are other things that stoke their fire, I'd rather hear that!

[Tituba]

Their worst moments are at cocktail parties, book launches or dinner parties where those taking time off from their highly paid labours to care for babies are humiliated by the crushing question, 'What do you do?', and the silence that follows the answer :' I'm a stay-at-home mum'" Look forward to comments on this one....

"humiliated by the crushing question" - well I guess what it comes down to is how you feel about yourself. No one should be "humilated" by stating what they do or who they are if they have healthy self esteem. I don't think the question is the problem nor society. I think the problem is not being proud of yourself and your life. If you are walking around ashamed of what you do or what you've achieved, then any question will make you defensive. Is it really the question or how you assume people are judging you? And if you feel judged, then you have to ask yourself why do other people's opinions mean so much to you? Rather than working on getting people to not ask questions, work needs to be done on self esteem.