Obama

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Re: Obama

Postby DJCNOR » Tue Mar 09, 2010 5:21 pm

Don't look now, Jcjm, But the Brits were duped by Bush and his pals and are mightly mad about it, so mad they are holding their people to account for not checking more efficiently before they believe Bush and company. Bush and his cronies may even find themselves indicted for war crimes in Europe. Donna
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Re: Obama

Postby Scenario Thinker » Wed Mar 10, 2010 7:21 am

jcjm wrote: ... they show it wasn't about what was right, but politics.
You said it ... politics. Like life, it's not fair.
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Re: Obama

Postby jcjm » Wed Mar 10, 2010 1:00 pm

Merk, Obama's big screw up is in my last post. He didn't correct known screw ups of Bush. Which in my mind makes him worse than Bush. Scenario, I guess I was wrong, but I thought the people who posted here were sincere in their views and not just towing the political line. DN...., I've seen some of the things the UK has brought up. At this point it is hard to see how anyone bought the intellegence which everyone (US, UK, Congress, etc) was buying. But as they say, hindsight is 20/20. I'm not sure how this all worked, but it looks to me like it is a perfect example of keeping things that supported their position, and throwing out things that didn't. With that system you could support just about anything you wanted to do. Just find some informants who supported your position and discard the rest. As far as war crimes, etc. it won't go anywhere because they do have intellegence to back it up, and everyone can blame the bad intellegence and get away with it because intellegence always has a high margin of error.
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Re: Obama

Postby merk » Wed Mar 10, 2010 1:32 pm

jcjm wrote:Merk, Obama's big screw up is in my last post. He didn't correct known screw ups of Bush. Which in my mind makes him worse than Bush.
Can you be more specific or are you saying he has corrected absolutely nothing at all? In either case i disagree with you because as i said - bush had 8 years to screw up - obama has had 1 year to try and fix them. Plus i think obama is fixing some things. Your argument still holds no water in my opinion. again - you're comparing apple seeds to apple trees.
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Re: Obama

Postby jcjm » Thu Mar 11, 2010 11:56 am

Merk, the thing you keep overlooking is that a new president doesn't start with a clean slate. They are responsible for everything from day one whether they initiated it or not. That's why I think Obama is worse than Bush. He stated all the bad decisions Bush made, said he would change them, then forgot about them and went on a campaign for healthcare, which wasn't even on the list of Bush's mistakes.
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Re: Obama

Postby merk » Thu Mar 11, 2010 1:05 pm

jcjm wrote:Merk, the thing you keep overlooking is that a new president doesn't start with a clean slate. They are responsible for everything from day one whether they initiated it or not. That's why I think Obama is worse than Bush. He stated all the bad decisions Bush made, said he would change them, then forgot about them and went on a campaign for healthcare, which wasn't even on the list of Bush's mistakes.
wrong, that is one of the most ridiculous things i've heard. He's responsible for trying to fix whatever problems he inherits. But he's not responsible for creating those mistakes in the first place. please tell me what issues you think he should have fixed by now that he hasn't fixed. Your argument here and a lot of what you said in the health debate thread just holds no water at all. I still wont go so far as tituba and say you are troll. But i wouldn't be surprised if you have some sort of compulsion to be the devils advocate in an argument no matter how pointless the argument is. It really does make no sense at all to say 'bush screwed everything up but obama is worse then bush because he hasn't fixed everything'. That's like me having 8 years to take apart a building and then saying the repairman is worse because he hasn't put all the pieces back together in 1 year. I'm actually going to turn off my notifications for this discussion now because that's how pointless this seems to me.
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Re: Obama

Postby jcjm » Fri Mar 12, 2010 11:42 am

Merk, would you have let Hitler's successor continue his policies, just because he didn't initiate them? If what George Bush did was so wrong, then IMMEDATE CHANGE is the only option. As I said before, you can't have it both ways. If it was so wrong, there must be immediate change, otherwise you are admitting the errors weren't significant, just political rhetoric which Obama had no better solution for. 1 We are still in Iraq and Afganistan 2 We are still at GITMO 3 Unemployment is worse, around 10% compared to 7% when Obama took office 4 Obama just followed Bush's lead on saving the Banks and Car companies. If Bush did all these things wrong, why didn't Obama change them.?
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Re: Obama

Postby Tituba » Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:47 pm

Yawn, hate to break this to you jcjm, but we aren't playing your game anymore. You are alone.
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Re: Obama

Postby jcjm » Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:34 am

That's because you can't come up with a logical answer. If Bush's decisions were truely so bad, Obama would have changed them. So you have 2 choices, neither of which you like 1) Obama is a bad President because he didn't change Bush's terrible policies 2) Bush wasn't as bad of a President as people made him out to be
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Re: Obama

Postby Scenario Thinker » Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:36 am

It isn't up to Obama alone to change everything. We've already mentioned that in the thread, sorry.
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Re: Obama

Postby jcjm » Sat Mar 13, 2010 8:41 am

It isn't up to Obama alone to change everything.
The same would hold true for Bush. If Obama can't change everything on his own, then neither could Bush.
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Re: Obama

Postby Scenario Thinker » Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:01 am

Then Bush's whole "team" was worse.
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Re: Obama

Postby Tituba » Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:43 am

That's because you can't come up with a logical answer.
No, it is because we have lives and have better things to do than to debate with you. Especially considering all you do is parrot the party line. Tell me jcjm, when was the last time you visited other threads and HELPED someone? Merk and I have better things to do. ST can make his own decision.
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Re: Obama

Postby Scenario Thinker » Sat Mar 13, 2010 11:21 am

Tituba wrote:ST can make his own decision.
Yeah, I think I'm outtie ...
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Re: Obama

Postby jcjm » Mon Mar 15, 2010 10:36 am

I'm not parroting any party line, I am making a simple IF-THEN statement. IF Bush was truley wrong in his poliicies THEN Obama would be obliged to change them. Since Obama hasn't then that leaves only too conclusions: 1) Obama is worse than Bush for not changing things he knows are wrong 2) Bush wasn't that much off because no better options exist
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